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NunjaBusiness Actual Hawk Posts: 376 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52394]
#52398 - 03/26/08 10:13 PM |
I am encouraged by most of these things. I especially like the noob channel and reworked Dew Valley for reasons we were just discussing in this very thread. The wishing well sounds a lot like the slot machine idea we were also just discussing. -------------------- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. - Arthur C. Clarke |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 903 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52394]
#52404 - 03/26/08 10:56 PM |
Ouch. Free players definitely won't be happy about this one, particularly the experience drop. I don't think people will care overmuch about the decreased Mythic usability and increased King's Coin Item costs, since those were not even available pre-Chunk 2; but experience... |
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Theck Armchair Warrior Posts: 34 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52404]
#52413 - 03/27/08 12:17 AM |
Yeah, I agree Necro: The experience drop is a little drastic I'd say. I guess everything else is alright, but now there is DEFINITELY a huge discrimination between free and members players. I think that the developers may want to rethink that one, as what they think will be a smart business move may end up creating more bad than good. Just my two cents.. - Theck |
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Stephen Big Boss Man Posts: 826 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52404]
#52414 - 03/27/08 12:21 AM |
Is the experience hit too much? Perhaps 15% would be more palatable... We're rethinking our free / member balance because in-game ads aren't meeting our expectations. Since turning on ads and giving more to free players our conversion rate from free to paid has halved. I don't know if you've noticed this, but we currently have zero paid ads in the game. It's been like that all this month. No paid ads means no ad revenue. No ad revenue means we're not paying our bills. Ad revenue was great in December. It's been terrible since January. Terrible with a capital "T"! No bones about it, we have to increase memberships. We're more than halving the number of static and movie ads you're gonna see. We're also going to remove the login / logout ads. The planned free player balance changes will likely increase our conversion rate. How much? We'll see. Exposure is another issue. The retail box will help generate some exposure and revenue. We're also thinking up and implementing ways to spread the word about Dungeon Runners on a shoestring marketing budget. We've got some cool things coming to help "virally" market the game. I hope you can see why these changes are needed. I'm open to other suggestions as well.  steve |
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mess_ion_ic Chicken Hawk Posts: 165 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52404]
#52415 - 03/27/08 12:28 AM |
The changes directed at new players are great, but I agree that nonmembers will definitely not like the changes to exp rates and drops, especially those who have been around a while. Guess we'll see how things develop... EDIT: After hearing about the nonmem changes, I suspected that might be the case (that the ads weren't generating enough revenue). The changes might convince more players to join, but it will most likely cause some to run off. It's a difficult problem, though. Maybe the exposure from the retail box will make up some of the difference. As far as other suggestions, ...all I can come up with right now is what other players have suggested elsewhere: wave something shiny over the membership form (e.g. rbs, etc). -------------------- Nebrius Edited by mess_ion_ic (03/27/08 12:37 AM) |
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Theck Armchair Warrior Posts: 34 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52414]
#52416 - 03/27/08 12:30 AM |
Quote: I, personally, can see where you're coming from Steve. You guys are a great team, I can tell that because I had posted my comment in response to Necro's concern about 10 minutes ago, and you've already responded to our concerns with perhaps rethinking the whole experience thing. Anyway, I think (and hope) that you guys will get alot of revenue from the physical retail game in stores. I'm not a game developer, nor do I pretend to be one, but I do know from my experience as being an online gamer that it is sometimes extremely tough to balance player satisfaction vs. money. SOE's Star Wars Galaxies is a prime example of the game's team leaning much more toward the money side and ignoring their community. I'm certainly not suggesting that you guys don't care about the community or anything, just acknowledging and giving props to you guys for working your best to balance the money vs. player community. That being said, all of the changes in this next build (perhaps experience could be re-looked like you mentioned) look absolutely awesome (and some of the ones that you mentioned will be upcoming.. **CRAFTING  **) and I can't wait to try them out myself.Best of luck you guys, and keep up the great work! - Theck |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 903 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52414]
#52419 - 03/27/08 12:50 AM |
I can understand why these changes are needed: many free players do not see the need to switch to Members when they can basically do most of the things Members can without too much extra hassle. These "gimps" as people are calling them to free players will encourage more people to pay for membership - I doubt very much people will quit or not try the game because of them. Personally, I don't find the 30% experience reduction too unsavoury: but I imagine it may be daunting for players new to the game. Perhaps this experience reduction could kick in at say, level 15? I mean, every new player is likely to be a non-member to start with. And yes, I have noticed that all the ads recently have been stuff like Guild Wars, Tabula Rasa, Exteel and stuff. Nothing that isn't from NCsoft itself. What is up with that? Regarding exposure, I personally found DR by stumbling across it on Google. Perhaps ads on popular internet sites, like Newgrounds, might help? |
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Darkwanderer Chicken Hawk Posts: 156 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52416]
#52420 - 03/27/08 12:55 AM |
Stephen I'm with you on this anything that you can get for free should not be equal to what you can get if you are paying for it. 25% sounds like a good number to me though. That should be a high enough number to get most people to switch over but not so high that they have to to play the game. Every other Free Rpg that i have played the Free play is extremly limited vs pay to play and this game went a little to far the other way. Im glad to see it going back to the way that i think that it should be. **edit** Great Idea Necro if you implement the xp reduction at lvl 15 that will give people enough time to try out the game. Then the Rbs start dropping at 15 and xp gets harder to get. Most will want to Pay right then.. Edited by Darkwanderer (03/27/08 12:58 AM) |
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Teclis Purveyor of Random Thoughts Posts: 1,021 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52416]
#52421 - 03/27/08 01:05 AM |
Ripper came on W7 tonight while a lot of us were on and we had a "cordial" discussion about the "non-member nerfs" to come. Personally, I agree with Necro and many others that membership should be easily and drastically discernable from non-membership (ala pre chunk 2 DR) - this update seems to address that oh so directly. My two cents about the whole membership and revenue situation, minding that I am also obviously not in marketing or a developer of any kind, is this. I think that EVERYONE should get membership status and benefits when they first sign up. There's no loss of content and availability to all the things that make/will make the game excellent. After say, 14 or 30 days - the "trial period" people would then need to sign up, or be reverted to non-member. That's enough time for the average player to get "hooked" so to speak and then, like what Ripper was saying but in my twist of it, they wouldn't want to be without it so they'd pony up and pay (the measly $5 as it still stands  ) I don't know how the specifics would work out, but it's just an idea. Ripper called it my "crack dealer plan" - lol, so be it if it worked. There aren't many other good games out there with "non-member" players to begin with, and we keep having this fight over the benefits of being and not being a member. I understand that in part reviews from other websites are important to bring in fresh recruits, and if we give them less to put us down with up front (the non-member statements ripper has said many of the reviews have said) and give them everything, with the option to keep it "for just $5 since it's so damn COOL!" then I think we'd see less bad-mouthing and more traffic. The more black and white we make it (like you're proposing stephen) the better off we are I think. Not being crass, just talling the truth on how I feel.On the rest of the proposed additions I say, "YES! and Thank you guys for listening!" Obviously the things that we talk (argue..lol) about here on the boards does get heard at least in some small way, and the updates you posted I think are proof positive of some of it. Keep up the good work, and thanks!  I anxiously await the hammer to fall... ::opens wallet and pulls out 4 dollar bills, 3 quarters, 2 dimes and a nickel, places in an envelope, and puts it into the "DR Monthly Fee" slot cut into the door at the devs office in Austin with "Swipers Dues" scribbled on the front:: More than glad to be a paying member |
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Cthulhu Rabbit Puncher Posts: 58 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52394]
#52424 - 03/27/08 02:14 AM |
I LOVE YOU STEPHEN....!!!! Well not REALLY but if even half of this comes to pass, this will make my $5 a month so worth it.... -------------------- "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" - Cthulhu fhtagn: 47°9′S, 126°43′W Character Stats |
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Cthulhu Rabbit Puncher Posts: 58 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52421]
#52425 - 03/27/08 02:17 AM |
Quote:I couldnt have said it any better myself.... -------------------- "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" - Cthulhu fhtagn: 47°9′S, 126°43′W Character Stats |
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CraigH Chicken Hawk Posts: 169 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52394]
#52430 - 03/27/08 05:15 AM |
Quote: Does this mean that current subscribing members may have access to the bling gnome? |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 903 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52414]
#52435 - 03/27/08 07:56 AM |
Another question. When can we expect to get this patch on the PTS, assuming everything goes to plan? |
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Elad_Baats Old Timer Posts: 400 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52435]
#52436 - 03/27/08 08:29 AM |
WOW I started a good discussion and poof mana from heaven and answers fromk the Big Guys.thanks Stephen. I like a small reduction if exp say 15 percent for nion members.but I also like the play free for 15 days then pay or gpo to non membe status with the exp reduction. The rest sounds interesting and will be great for teh game..........11 more dungeons sounds wonderful -------------------- Ghad. Creative Arch Obsidian Mage LVL 100 refugee from the Lost World 30 0 PVP wins 0 PVP Loss's and proud of it Un Official Squeaky Wheel |
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MasterWeedhead Chicken Hawk Posts: 199 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52394]
#52448 - 03/27/08 12:47 PM |
Note to self: Get to lvl 100 and get all non-mem RBs before the patch. Quote: I think I wanted this for some time. -------------------- http://threeplanetssoftware.com/software/dr/Crackersd Like my Halo avatar, I'm red, you're blue. Edited by MasterWeedhead (03/27/08 12:49 PM) |
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Cebyth Rabbit Puncher Posts: 75 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52448]
#52455 - 03/27/08 01:46 PM |
Wow, I can hardly wait...30% EXP reduction for non members? Good call, why should everyone have the chance to play for the equal amount of entertainment? I mean, cough up if you don't wanna get brainwashed by 30% more time you spend on grinding! I have an even better idea! Let's make special quests (members only) with EXP rewards that level you up 45% faster than just plain old grinding! O.o OMG wait! Why don't non member quests give you 50% less cash and King's Coin rewards?! Or even make certain dungeons inaccessible to non members! May I quote an old friend of mine's answer he gave me when I asked why he's refusing to get membership? Quote: You even added more mythics?! YAY!!!! But WTH are non mems going to do with those?! With some pathetic 5% chance to have usability of the item (scoffs). New dungeons? Well, that's a relief...no really, really. I mean, if it seems EXP rewards from quests will NEVER be implemented in the game, why not grind with that extra leveling homework you got in some new dungeons? Unless, of course, you agree with the above suggestion about making some dungeons inavailable to non mems. Please ladies and gentlemen, allow me to quote the reaction of my friend, a non mem player, when I told her about what's coming up in the next build: Quote: How can you call this "player balancing"? What's to be balanced here?! Basically, the message you're giving us, if this is the only solution for your problems, is: "Pay or suffer!!!" I'm sure there are ways to think of that'll work better than this...if not...well, I'm not the sort of person who leaves when things get a bit tougher. But I really don't like the way things are going right now... |
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MasterWeedhead Chicken Hawk Posts: 199 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52455]
#52456 - 03/27/08 01:49 PM |
Pay of Suffer (you won't die just because you don't have all the cool items or high lvls)? It's' more like pay or life gets hard in DR. -------------------- http://threeplanetssoftware.com/software/dr/Crackersd Like my Halo avatar, I'm red, you're blue. |
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Cebyth Rabbit Puncher Posts: 75 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52456]
#52457 - 03/27/08 02:05 PM |
Wow, do I really have to quote myself boyo? Quote: I won't die, but this is just absurd. Pretty soon there'll be skills that'll only be usable if you're premium, as well as dungeons and quests I reckon. But reducing EXP gathering rate by 30%? And they put in new RBs...but for a measly 5% to acquire one you can use, it's pretty much obsolete, isn't it? How the hell is this supposed to attract more people to get membership?! By further nerfing non members? Oh, I have an idea; why not, for a friggin' change, increase the cost of membership for premium players, leave things the way they are, and give 'em some extra perks in return? Huh?! How about that?! But nooooooooo, instead, let's squish the non mems some more...like, they have the honors of watching those bloody ads every fu*kin' time they log in/out or die! Hopefully some weak-minded idiot will pay attention to them? And how the hell does advertising the Melo M4 whatever shoes, Guild Wars and Tabula Rasa help NC Soft?! |
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Elad_Baats Old Timer Posts: 400 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52457]
#52460 - 03/27/08 02:46 PM |
ello Cebyth, I ahve read your comemnts, and your suggestions and they might have a bit more validity if the cost of membership as say 30 dolars a month. But we are talkign aobut 5 a month. If you are that cheap then we wont miss you anyway. If your read Stepehens posting , the attempts to have the adds pay for the game is not working, and another solution is needed. this is another attempt to keep this game viable. Sicne it seems youare a fan of the non member variety of play.then youarent supporting the game as it is right now..................ssacrifices need to be made and not by those that actually pay for this game. -------------------- Ghad. Creative Arch Obsidian Mage LVL 100 refugee from the Lost World 30 0 PVP wins 0 PVP Loss's and proud of it Un Official Squeaky Wheel |
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Anson All-Knowing Arch White Ninja Posts: 174 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52455]
#52462 - 03/27/08 03:11 PM |
Quote: Here's what happened: we started the ad system, and based on our projections of the revenue we'd get from ads, brought nonmembers up to almost complete parity with members. We got some complaints from members, but our stance was very simple: we want everyone who is bringing revenue in to be able to enjoy the full game... and we want those who aren't bringing revenue to feel the urge to change. Our stance hasn't changed... what has changed is that our experience with the ad system didn't meet our expectations. We are still exploring our options, and I expect the system to get refined and improved over time, and hopefully we can provide more options. But for now, we need to focus on bringing up subscriptions, and then we can look at options that will once again open up the game to free players. Our business model will continue to evolve until we get it right... as of right now, we definitely don't have it right, and it needs to change for chunk #3. |
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Morganaise New Kid Posts: 19 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52462]
#52464 - 03/27/08 03:51 PM |
I'd like to just throw out some suggestions that I've seen done on other games for improving visibility of the game and to get non-mems to convert to mems: 1. The biggest reason a person converts is "You have something I want and I'm willing to pay for it." So you need something more then armour and more exp to get someone to open their wallet. I've seen no mention of Member Only Dungeons. Nothing makes a person salivate more then coming up on something they can't get. 2. Utilize Vote links for MMORPG voting sites. People really do use this to look for a new game. Not sure what you could give for voting.. maybe Kings Coins? 3. Look into game site such as Gamehouse.com. When Runescape put themselves on these, influx of new users was so great, current members were highly annoyed because of all the newbies in the game.. and more newbies maans more potential members. WHAT WE, THE PLAYERS CAN DO: 1. Become members of course is the first. You love this game? Support it! Don't just whine that you'll get nerfed... open your wallet. 2. IT'S TIME FOR N00B BASHING TO STOP! I see this more on Dungeon Runners then I've seen in other games. We, the current members, need to welcome newbies, help them, give them a reason to stay. People will come back if they feel welcomed. I love the new "N00b channel" because those of us currently in the game who want to help newbies can join and help, and those who hate dealing with newbies don't have to. Stephen has explained that, for various reasons, they can't have player MODs in game so it's up to us to do what we can to make this a fun place to play. I also encourage the Devs to find a way to join the game more often and police chat more often. I know this is a crappy job to do but it can't hurt to keep a monitor open while you work and jump in every once in awhile. One reason I choose to support the game with my hard earned cash was the fact that the Devs were so hands on.. they're in this thread participating.. they play the game with us. People LOVE that. From what Stephen and Anson have said the game is in financial crises. They have taken on more expenses expecting better income that didn't come in. I, for one, am willing to help all I can to make sure they can keep all those great new devs that have joined the DR family. I'm not sure how much people realize what a unique game this is. Not just the content and programming.. it's the whole "rogue" philosophy that is missing in other games. It's a place where "mature" players are welcomed and can let their hair down and have fun. I've come to love this game in the short time I've been here, not for the content, but for the people. -------------------- Morganaise -- Mage TheRose -- Fighter |
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JoeB1978 Acolyte of Saint Iggy Posts: 1,332 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52457]
#52465 - 03/27/08 03:58 PM |
Well this shouldn't as a surprise ... the first of im sure many flaming posts from non-members. Most of which I am guessing didn't play before chunk 2 came out and non-members were truly gimped. As it stands now there is little to no reason to be a member ... this needed to change. Most paying members were asking why they should keep paying for virtually identical benefits. Instead of giving members more (and having non-members complain about it) they are taking a different approach. Personally I don't see any problem with it, although 30% may be a little steep for exp but I know they are still throwing that number around. The numbers for rainbows is spot on though. I wasn't happy when non-members gained access to them in the first place (of course my opinion on that). -------------------- JoeB - Level 100 - Back to a Fighter where he belongs SirOldBottom - Level 49 - Ice Mage Mearlin - Level 29 - Mage Dungeon Runners Map Build 0.110 |
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Cthulhu Rabbit Puncher Posts: 58 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52464]
#52467 - 03/27/08 04:24 PM |
Quote:With all due respect I dont get this impression at all from reading their posts. What I DO gather from this is that if something is not done SOON to "right the ship" THEN there will be issues, but right now it still seems like things are full speed ahead. They're trying and they are doing everything humanly possible to keep DR from becoming a "victim of it's own success"..... Keep on! -------------------- "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" - Cthulhu fhtagn: 47°9′S, 126°43′W Character Stats |
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Stephen Big Boss Man Posts: 826 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52465]
#52468 - 03/27/08 04:30 PM |
Honestly, does flaming seem like it's gonna do you any good? Not likely. When concerned posts are made reacting to a potential change, I happily listen and adjust. But when the flames start, I'm likely to tune those posters out. Mostly because they have no interest in working with us... they just want to flame us. Let's see. We could increase XP rate for members (either through XP for quests or some other mechanic), which is ultimately the same as reducing the rate for non-members. Perhaps the perception would be different. I guess that really depends on how we advertise the difference. We don't want to make you suffer when playing for free. But we do want to ensure membership will enhance the game enough to warrant the $5 fee. Overwhelming feedback from many members and ex-members tells me that the membership isn't compelling enough to pay for now that free players are on par with members. Slower leveling for free players is definitely an incentive to pay. 30% reduction is seemingly too high. 15% seems far more reasonable. If you want to level faster, pay. If you want easy access to Mythics, pay. 15% more time investment isn't gonna ruin the game for most folks. Perhaps we can add an XP modifier to the difficulty setting? Play on higher difficulty and you gain some bonus XP... That could work. I'm all for adding more features for members. However, we need to make adjustments sooner rather than later. This next build is all full on new features and content. There's no time to whip up some whiz-bang membership feature that will make everyone want to convert (whatever that would be). As always, we're open to suggestions. For those of you that missed this part of my earlier posting: we are removing the login / logout ads as well as vastly reducing the chance you'll see ads on death and zone change. steve Edited by Stephen (03/27/08 04:34 PM) |
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MasterWeedhead Actual Hawk Posts: 200 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52468]
#52469 - 03/27/08 04:46 PM |
Potential Solutions: 1. Make ads on forums (on the side) 2. Make ads appeal to players (Ex: In the past few months, there was an ad for a basketball shoe. Only a few of us are interested in that ad because most people who play games wouldn’t want a basketball shoe). Make ads with discounts (Ex: Pay for 1 year of DR and get 1 month free) 3. Stocks Make DR Shop (Ex: Sell 1 foot action figure of your current character for x amount of money) PS: Perhaps ads other than other NCSoft games would generate more money. -------------------- http://threeplanetssoftware.com/software/dr/Crackersd Like my Halo avatar, I'm red, you're blue. Edited by MasterWeedhead (03/27/08 04:48 PM) |
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Keriala New Kid Posts: 9 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52468]
#52470 - 03/27/08 04:47 PM |
I am a member and I think playing DR is so much fun that I get more than my money's worth in return. Thanks for the game as it is now and all the new content that is coming. I love the idea of an experience bonus in higher difficulty. Right now playing on insane is only good for my self conceit. Most probably not a new suggestion, but a kind of trade window to swap items between the characters in one account - maybe member only - would be a nice addition. Edited by Keriala (03/27/08 04:50 PM) |
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Stephen Big Boss Man Posts: 826 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52469]
#52471 - 03/27/08 04:49 PM |
Quote: I like that idea, MasterWeedHead. The problem is that we're not getting any paid ads at this time. Our ad provider has not been able to provide paid ads for quite some time. steve |
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Dooms QA Posts: 130 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52471]
#52474 - 03/27/08 04:57 PM |
Quote: *Office Space voice, to the ad machine* "What is it you say you do here, anyway?" -------------------- Dooms Dungeon Runners QA To fight the bug, we must understand the bug. We can ill afford another Klendathu. Edited by Dooms (03/27/08 06:06 PM) |
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MasterWeedhead Actual Hawk Posts: 200 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52471]
#52476 - 03/27/08 05:05 PM |
Add on to suggestions: 4.Make DR environmentally friendly (good luck on this one). How come there aren't any paid ads at the time? Doesn't make much sense. Company make ads all the time. Imagine Bud Lite commercials on DR. You could try to associate DR with the product. Take DR Pepper for example. Have a guy playing DR while drinking DP. Dr Pepper headquaters is located in Plano, TX just so you know (Plano is awesome, use to live there). -------------------- http://threeplanetssoftware.com/software/dr/Crackersd Like my Halo avatar, I'm red, you're blue. Edited by MasterWeedhead (03/27/08 05:10 PM) |
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Darkwanderer Chicken Hawk Posts: 156 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52474]
#52477 - 03/27/08 05:14 PM |
Ouch Dooms Taking a shot at the big boss man!!! To put out a Dr store would cost more money money that they need. Advertising this game on other website is the best thing to do on top of everything else that you are all ready putting forth in this chunk I know that I have stated this before before but I agree Non members need to be nerfed.. There are a Hundred Different Game wesite out there that have you DL games for free like Bubble Box, New Grounds , Time Killer, Addictinggames.com and so many more getting this game out there to the general public that play these little flash games is the target audience in all reality. The flash games that they play are all high in Satire(like DR) high in hummor(like DR) and Low in Time Constraint(like DR) I would love to see us on more of those sites the amount of player base should increase dramaticaly thus increasing the Amount of members that we have. Oh yeah ill keep trying to convert some of these Non Members to Pay up lol taunt them with Uber RBS that are members HAHAHAHAHHAHA!!!! |
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Mama_Anarchia Actual Hawk Posts: 331 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52471]
#52479 - 03/27/08 05:22 PM |
Quote:Quote: This answers one of my potential questions. Any chance you could sack these guys and get someone else? I have quite a bit more to say but will chime in later. -------------------- ------------------------------------------------- MamaAnarchia Level 100 Genius Arch Arcane Mage Parkaboy Level 59 Athletic Seasoned Poison Ranger CayceP Level 28 Muscular Hardened Fanatical Fighter |
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MasterWeedhead Chicken Hawk Posts: 199 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52479]
#52481 - 03/27/08 05:27 PM |
Quote:Quote:Quote: Come to think of it, DR toothpaste would be pretty cool . Mmmmmmm, so that's what whisker rats taste.As for the DR store, it's a virtual store with costum made design. So it's not an actual store which you can walk in and get something when you walk out. -------------------- http://threeplanetssoftware.com/software/dr/Crackersd Like my Halo avatar, I'm red, you're blue. Edited by MasterWeedhead (03/27/08 05:37 PM) |
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Dooms QA Posts: 130 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52477]
#52484 - 03/27/08 05:42 PM |
Quote: Heh! Just to clarify here that wasn't a shot at Steve at all, just the inadequate amount of ads. It reminded me of a quote from Office Space. I like my job. A lot. Don't hurt me! *cowers* -------------------- Dooms Dungeon Runners QA To fight the bug, we must understand the bug. We can ill afford another Klendathu. |
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Crickette Community Goddess Posts: 371 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52484]
#52485 - 03/27/08 05:57 PM |
Dooms, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into storage B. We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space we can get. So if you could just go ahead and pack up your stuff and move it down there, that would be terrific, OK? -------------------- "Always keep your words soft and sweet in case you have to eat them" Crickette Dungeon Runners Community Manager http://www.facebook.com/people/Crickette_NCsoft/1076637397 |
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Dooms QA Posts: 130 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52485]
#52486 - 03/27/08 06:03 PM |
*mumbles* I..... I could burn down the dungeon. -------------------- Dooms Dungeon Runners QA To fight the bug, we must understand the bug. We can ill afford another Klendathu. |
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Cthulhu Rabbit Puncher Posts: 58 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52486]
#52490 - 03/27/08 07:31 PM |
Quote:Me listens to Talking Head's.... Burning Down the House... -------------------- "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" - Cthulhu fhtagn: 47°9′S, 126°43′W Character Stats |
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Elad_Baats Old Timer Posts: 400 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52485]
#52491 - 03/27/08 08:36 PM |
can I have Doom's stapler??? Since he is errr moving and all -------------------- Ghad. Creative Arch Obsidian Mage LVL 100 refugee from the Lost World 30 0 PVP wins 0 PVP Loss's and proud of it Un Official Squeaky Wheel |
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Teclis Purveyor of Random Thoughts Posts: 1,021 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52468]
#52492 - 03/27/08 08:59 PM |
Quote: YES, finally it comes from the "big man's" mouth directly! Thank you! Lots of us (myself consistently, and I have no problem admitting it) say "that" everyday and get flak from some people - NOW who wants to say something eh? Just pay up already. I don't know how else to say it besides "it's just $5". I can't even say that much about getting lunch at work even once a WEEK. Sorry non-mems, but I think it's finally gotten black&white, and to cause such stress with people (the devs included) it seems to simple a solution just to pay $5 and end all the need for all this extra time that could be getting spent on content rather than how to appease some people that are playing a game for free that people have designed, used equipment to make, and spend everyday maintaining and updating....apparently also and expectantly by some, for free.I don't think stephen sounded mad necessarily but I feel that his post had some kind of underlying tense to it. I can't say I blame him... If I was expected to do my job everyday by a bunch of people that expected to show up when they wanted to show up and have their product ready for them whenever, how they want it - for free - I'd get pretty tired of it quick when after a while they started complainging about what they were getting... |
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Stephen Big Boss Man Posts: 826 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52492]
#52496 - 03/27/08 10:07 PM |
Quote: I'm not that tense. Folks playing a free game without paying isn't much cause for tension. However! What does make me tense is that our expectations for in-game advertising have proved to be insane. Sure, our predictions were spot-on for December... but since then the revenue has fallen like a rock. No ads means no ad revenue. No revenue means we need to make a change. What's funny to me is that I was approached by our Creative Director back in October. He suggested to me that we not be so quick to give so much to the free players -- just in case the advertising model failed. I dismissed that and went right on making the risky changes. My thinking was "Heck, if we're gonna make money on ads for free players then we need to make sure the free players want to play." The thinking was sound, but the outcome isn't what we expected or even close to what we need. So, I'm in the unfortunate situation of having to backpeddle a bit to repair the problem. That being said, Teclis, you're completely right. We're in this to make a living. We love making Dungeon Runners better... but we simply can't do that forever without being profitable. I want free players to play the game... but I also want a healthy percentage of them to convert to paid. Otherwise I'll be unemployed at some point. steve |
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Tetness Old Timer Posts: 486 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52496]
#52498 - 03/27/08 11:21 PM |
I'm starting up an organization called "Gamers for Dungeon Runners Fund" and I'm asking for everyone out there to sponsor a developer. For just $5 a month you could make all the difference in a developers life. Like, ensuring that they have food on the table for their families, clothes on their backs, and a good eduction for the kids. And in return for your $5 a month you will have access to a broad world called Dungeon Runners. Imagine, for just pennies a day you could be the difference in someones life. /commercial Come on people... it's just five freakin' dollars. Skip that McDonalds once a month, buy one less pack of cigarettes, drink one less beer at the bar, go without a candy bar a couple times a month. Grab that $5 bill outta your mom's purse. It doesn't take much to come up with $5. Disclaimer - writer in no way endorses theft as a means to play any computer game. Such activities are criminal and offenders may be prosecuted to the fullest extent of their fathers foot against their a$$. If such activities do occur, writer absolves himself of any liability of blame for actions of offender. |
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Kalero New Kid Posts: 12 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52414]
#52499 - 03/27/08 11:42 PM |
I have been playing this game for quite a few months now and have 3 member accounts although one is actually for a friend. I have played just about every MMO out there starting with Everquest (before any expansions came out) and even beta tested a few. One of the biggest reasons that I quit any of the MMOs I have played at one time was because of nerfs. Yes I fully realize that some times things go into games that are not really right and I sometimes even agree with those reasons. But that does not mean I do not get frustrated while I am leveling slower than previously or that my character is not as powerful as it was before. I was really really close to cancelling all 3 memberships when the monsters got harder a few patches ago when the nonmembers started getting member gear. Not because it was really all that much harder or anything. It just got annoying. The reason I talk about nerfs is because I do not really think it might help to nerf the nonmembers to make them hopefully go member. I believe that in a paying/nonpaying game people are usually only going switch to paying if the paying members have some kind of serious advantage over the nonmembers. Some of the things that could give members an advantage over nonmembers have been talked about already in the forums so I wont go over any detailed points but here is a list of things I can think of whether already in the forums or not. Exp slider coinciding with the difficulty slider Member only dungeons Member only quests Members gaining a little exp off of any quest or maybe specific ones or nonrepeatable quests Member only quests with Mythic rewards Certain of the new Mythics being member only with no chance of nonmember Higher chance of getting Mythic sam or sally Higher chance of getting Mythics (Yeah I know Ill probably get flamed for this one hehe) Member only treasure chests (maybe 2 extra after each boss fight that are member only) Members being able to change the colors of certain weapons or armors or maybe only certain parts of them Cross server members only chat channel These are just a few things off the top of my head and sorry if I ganked anyones idea that has already been posted. |
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Dark_Lord_Bogey Old Timer Posts: 521 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52498]
#52500 - 03/28/08 12:05 AM |
I've already bought my next timecard:) and then figured out I didn't need it for like 2 weeks:) but oh well....money well spent as far as i'm concerned:) Now did I read right?!?!? we're getting the bling Gnome? before the retail box?!?!?!? and hey can we pre-order it at Gamestop ????? (shameless plug since I'm a store manager there) Gary |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 903 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52499]
#52502 - 03/28/08 12:09 AM |
Personally, I don't think anything major should be "Members Only": because if it is, it begins to make the "free MMORPG" claim invalid. However, making it harder for free players to get things that members can get much easily is just as good a trigger for free players to convert to members: for example, the changes in this patch... bit harder to level, bit harder to use the King's Coins vendors, bit... I mean, considerably harder to get Mythics, which considering they are the rarest items is perfectly reasonable. So far, DR's membership benefits have been based around this: not actually restricting any content for free players, but free players have a slightly harder time getting some of the things. I have nothing against this. However, stuff like members only quests, members only dungeons, members only Mythics... this starts to trample the claim of a "free MMORPG". I personally would prefer Membership benefits to be conveniences, rather than game content: things that will make the game more fun and less tedious, but not things that you will need to play the game to its fullest. That is, of course, my personal opinion: but I think it is a valid one. I'm not a game developer, but I believe that "convenience" benefits can convert just as many people to Membership as "content" benefits can. |
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Anson All-Knowing Arch White Ninja Posts: 174 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52500]
#52505 - 03/28/08 12:14 AM |
Quote: Well... sorta. It's kind of weird getting a retail box ready on a game that's been live for so long, but there's a delay between when we have (and provide) the gold master for the DVD in the box and when the box is available in stores. Because we're advertising the Bling Gnomes as an exclusive to the retail box, we have to be 100% certain the Bling Gnomes will be available as soon as someone uses a box. Chunk 3 is going to be the gold master, so it will have the Bling Gnomes. However, the Bling Gnomes are still going to be a retail exclusive, so you won't be able to activate them until the box is in stores.  |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 903 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52505]
#52508 - 03/28/08 12:16 AM |
Tell me it will be in Australia. =( |
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NunjaBusiness Actual Hawk Posts: 376 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52496]
#52511 - 03/28/08 01:05 AM |
As many of you know, I have very little compunction about pissing off or insulting someone, so I have no problem saying the following: "Anyone (non-member) who leaves because of the listed changes would not have converted to paying and probably clicked on ZERO ads in the game anyway. I will not miss any of those whiners." (Obviously, if this does not describe you the comment was not directed AT YOU, so zip it!) It is just like the (US) people who pay little to no income tax to start with complaining about the delay for the $600 "stimulus" check from Uncle Sam. Free money isn't good enough - it has to be FAST and FREE. Just shut up and go away now. I have some background in advertising and just happen to work for a company that develops and markets software for very specific business needs so I do know a little about the subject. We found targeted advertisements on XM radio to be extremely cost-effective and successful. The availability of "product lite" with fewer features and less cost is also looking like it may have been a good idea. The (print) magazine Games For Windows just had a "Best Free Online Games" issue and I was disappointed to see no mention of DR in it. It would have compared favorably to many of those reviewed, but was notably missing. Someone should have made sure DR was represented. What it all boils down to is a significant lack of effective or adequate marketing. I hate to beleaguer the obvious, but "if it don't work, don't keep doing it." If this marketing is being done with/by employees, a "come to jesus" meeting is in order with some extremely tight deadlines and high expectations. If it is an outside agency - pick another one. Do not throw good money after bad and let them try again. If what they came up with did not work, they were not the right people to start with. Lets face it, there is no shortage of advertising services out there. Advertising and product marketing has experienced a sea change in the past 10 years and the old methods no longer work as well. Possibly because the potential consumers are a totally different breed of cat than their parents were and are swayed by different attacks. Nowadays, Viral and Evangelical marketing methods seem to be better than old-school ones. For one thing, you already have a fairly good-sized pool of potential evangelists here that a savvy marketing person could utilize. -------------------- Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. - Arthur C. Clarke |
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Cthulhu Rabbit Puncher Posts: 58 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52511]
#52512 - 03/28/08 01:24 AM |
I hate to say this: Nunja's right about the NCSoft Advertising Department...... "Image Is EVERYTHING" may be cliche but if you miss opportunities to promote Brand Awareness for your product, how can you now say that subscription levels are lower then they were forecast? How can you be "spot on" one week and not even show up to play the next week? If your Ad Agency that handles the 'In Game' Adverts doesn't deliver anything live in several months, why do you keep them on the payroll? Not trying to sound accusatory but the (IMHO) consistently missed chances to Evangelize Dungeon Runners is starting to hurt more then help and your Ad Department needs to (Especially before the Retail Gold Master is released) focus LESS on what the Dev's are giving to the free players and MORE on making the Dungeon Runners Brand "THE Next Great Thing in MMORPG's..." -------------------- "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" - Cthulhu fhtagn: 47°9′S, 126°43′W Character Stats |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 903 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52512]
#52514 - 03/28/08 01:54 AM |
Forward, Evangelists of DR! Spread the Gospel of Gosh to all the Distant Forums of the Internet! FORWARD! <Insert fanatical eye gleam here> |
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Snarky Rabbit Puncher Posts: 86 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52512]
#52523 - 03/28/08 06:25 AM |
First the dirty business: I think its just wrong to attack their entire advertising department because an advertising model they came up with isn't working. You'll remember Stephen himself said that some were wary of the advertising model, and he pushed forwards anyways. This is not a slight against him, I'm a risk taker myself, and he did what he thought was needed. Now, how can you blame their ad department when you don't know what their doing, nor how many there are. There may be contracts involved with the ads. Would you rather they get no money, or lose money paying off a contract? Now the good stuff: What have you done for DR? Sure ya kick in your $5 a month, but have you told your friends? Have you made a viral video, or posted it on your (insert social networking) page? We can surely all help out before casting stones at the ad department (even if it *is* their fault) in little ways. Maybe we can create a DR channel in youtube, or put a link back to dungeonrunners.com from our websites. (Oh, Devs... where's that fansite pack we've been waiting for? Pleeeeaaaase!) I've had an idea for a web-based game that would use stored character data and have you battle little monsters, or something. To get ahead you'd have to level up in game, though I'd probably allow for 'on the web' gold pieces which could be redeemed for.... something, who knows. Also, I'm sure there's an artist out there or two, how about coming up with designs for them to use on Cafepress, since then they wouldn't have to pay out anything to set up the 'business'. More shirts = more revenue, and also more advertising. Just my thoughts, $0.02 is you will (or 0.0002 Euro... thanks for pointing that out Magnus). |
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Cebyth Rabbit Puncher Posts: 75 |
Re: My thoughts and suggestion on the Game [Re: #52523]
#52524 - 03/28/08 07:11 AM |
Funny how people automatically make wrong assumptions, so let me clarify; 1. Yes, I've played long before Chunk #2 and with alotta my friends being members and me having lots of fun in the game I thought: "What the hell, it's worth the 5$ a month!" Then Chunk #2 came out and made it practically obsolete doncha think? You basically had everything members did, just in smaller doses. Don't call me cheap or poor or a whiner, if I had become premium before the Chunk I'd also prolly be against giving non mems usage of Mythic Items. 2. I stated in my post that I WON'T leave the game just because things got a bit tougher. How exactly did you derive from that statement that I'm threatening to leave? 3. I really don't care whether someone will "miss" me or not. That's not the reason why I posted, to tell people I'm "leaving" *cough. I'm just so frustrated that after gaining all those bonuses which say: "Hey, like, everything is totally free now dude, you don't even have to pay to enjoy the same quality gameplay members do!" you get nerfed so badly, in the terms: "Sorry, Premiums own everything again." 4. Maybe I shouldn't have exploded like that, true, just in the moment of anger, but the people who replied to my posts calling me a cheap n00bish free players, are, oh guess...Premiums. I don't know how the devs' business is running, but if this is the only solution to actually support the game, then I guess I should just start paying, eh? I've been telling people this game would eventually evolve into a standard pay-to-play game...but no one listened... no one >_> |
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