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Shimmer New Kid Posts: 18 |
Where are some Devs??
#18191 - 03/25/07 05:19 AM |
I have been playing now for awhile (not super long, but for a bit) and I have seen numerous unhappy, but constructive posts. Many of the posts are what I would assume a game Dev would love to get, not just endless whining, but detailed problems and suggestions. So far though, I havnt seen even one (not saying that there might be some post somewhere, but recently...) response from a game Dev on their game. Do they read this forums??? Why bother having a suggestion forum if they arnt even going to give some minor feedback. They over nerfed this last patch (especially stuff that is a tiny bit higher) and have had numerous posts asking/pleading for some action and not a word from the Devs (that I have seen). Even SoE which is known far and wide for their crap customer support manages to have some Dev responses occasionally. I guess I could understand if this game was completely free but some of us are paying 5 bucks for ONE character and that actually isnt that cheap. So do the Devs 'ever' speak up or let us know anything??? If not I am not sure if I am going to continue to shell out money for this. -------------------- *~*~*shimmer*~*~*  the robeless mage
!!!vote for robes now!!! |
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Swordgleam Old Timer Posts: 510 |
Re: Where are some Devs??
#18194 - 03/25/07 07:47 AM |
Check out the 'dev digest' in the Announcements forum. You can find every post a dev makes there. They have been around, though note quite as much as usual - that doesn't mean they aren't reading, just not posting as much. -------------------- Swordgleam - Level 40-something Arcane Fighter Vanishing into the wilderness from May 25 to late August. |
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ninny Rabbit Puncher Posts: 91 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18194]
#18261 - 03/26/07 01:10 AM |
Actually i always find it a good thing when devs don't post alot...even though there are several things i'd like to hear them respond to. But i say its a good thing because it means they are too busy working on the game to post <g>. |
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LiquidX Actual Hawk Posts: 286 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18261]
#18262 - 03/26/07 01:13 AM |
Quote: Unfortunetly, it's a double edged sword. If the Dev's don't talk enough, then people feel they are being ignored. If the Dev's talk too much, then people feel they are spending all their time talking and not working on the game. Unfortunetly, there rarely seems to be a happy medium. |
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Sinister New Kid Posts: 20 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18262]
#18264 - 03/26/07 01:25 AM |
Well I believe they have people who's sole job is to read and respond to forums and to make sure they are going smoothly. Forum admin and what not. Forums are actually a fairly big part of a succesful gameing community. |
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LiquidX Actual Hawk Posts: 286 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18264]
#18278 - 03/26/07 02:28 AM |
Quote: That'd be Crickette. |
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freako New Kid Posts: 3 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18278]
#18287 - 03/26/07 08:45 AM |
There are actually some Dev responses on here. Don't forget at the end of the day its their game, and they can do with it as they please. If us (the people) like the game we will play it...if we don't we won't! One thing i think people need to get out their heads, this is including myself cos i do it just as much, is that we have a right to tell the developers how to do things and being so political about all the patches. SWG is the worst for this (obviously ^^) and if people just stopped to think how much actually changed not only would they be less pissed at the dev's but they would enjoy their game again. And that can't be a bad thing now can it? |
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Snowbird Rabbit Puncher Posts: 80 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18287]
#18304 - 03/26/07 11:37 AM |
As said before a Community Manager is supposed to handle all the discontent on the boards. For a real game, that is. |
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Crickette Community Goddess Posts: 288 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18304]
#18309 - 03/26/07 12:45 PM |
Naturally, you guys can't tell what thread I'm reading/reviewing at any given moment - unless I post in it, of course. So I understand where the questions come from...it is an issue that every community manager has  But I do read a lot of posts on here. In fact, I read most of them - if not all of them. But I don't post my own personal opinions, nor do I want to simply say "hey, I'm reading your thread!" to every single thread Not only would that be time consuming, but gosh, I'd be reported for spamming. And then I'd have to go yell at myself.I do take the feedback from the boards and then send it out via internal reporting methods (top secret, ssssh) so yes, your posts do matter! It isn't quantity in posts, but quality. As long as you post WHY you feel a particular way (following the rules, of course) you are doing everyone here a great service. We aren't here to listen to whatever we may want to hear. We want the truth. And we can handle the truth! So please, keep it up. -------------------- "Always keep your words soft and sweet in case you have to eat them" Crickette Dungeon Runners Community Manager |
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Ragnar11 Armchair Warrior Posts: 42 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18309]
#18312 - 03/26/07 01:52 PM |
I just got too involved in this to shut my mouth Quote: Actually giving some fast feedback wouldnt take long. I dont expect mods to read every single post, but atleast the most well put feedback from your playerbase. What boggles me was the last patch, how many disagreed with the way things turned out. I think there is a weak link between some of the communication, yes I do. |
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Turnips Rabbit Puncher Posts: 97 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18312]
#18318 - 03/26/07 02:41 PM |
How many disagree is a good question, its an old saying that 1 unsatisfied customer makes the sound of 1000 satisfied. Not to say a lot dont agree or anything fancy like that. |
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LiquidX Actual Hawk Posts: 286 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18312]
#18320 - 03/26/07 02:53 PM |
Quote: However, the mods are not the same people who work on the game (The Developers). Crickette is the Community Coordinator. (And not just for Dungeon Runners, either. She's also the Community Coordinator for at least one other NCSoft game). Her job is as a go-between between us, and the Dev's, and she oversee's the moderators. The Dev's (Stephen, VonLiebermann, ect) are the ones who actually work on the game itself. They are the ones who decide what features get implemented, and when. Crickette and the Mods simply deal with things like regulating the forums, ensuring that posts adhere to the rules, and so on. While Crickette DOES pass feedback from the playerbase to the Devs (like most NCSoft community Coordinators), she can't really offer feedback to us on our ideas for the game itself because she has no controll over what the Dev's do. |
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Ragnar11 Armchair Warrior Posts: 42 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18320]
#18345 - 03/26/07 06:50 PM |
Quote: Right, and thats really what makes me sick. We get no feedback, whats the point on giving advice then? The chance for your ideas to be considered is the same as trying to win money in lotto. If they where wanting to take good ideas/suggestions seriously, they should give a sign they apreciate it with giving some feedback in a way. People get confused on what will happend, and leave in frustration in the end. I can not see why a game company want this to happend. If I worked for NCsoft I would have been on the forum, then talked with the Devs, then given my wonderful player base good feedback on what the Devs thought about the ideas. This way you knew atleast "ok my idea was abit short thought through, maby I should work more on that idea".. but nope, its not working like that in here, you just simply dont know if you have been heard, and completly wasted alot of time "trying" to help NCsoft. Is this the way they pay back their customers for trying to gather useful information? |
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Sinister New Kid Posts: 20 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18312]
#18351 - 03/26/07 07:27 PM |
Well i'm not a developer of some great game and what not...but I do own/run a clan of a goodly number of people, in a game called Armagetron advanced. In this game we host our own server with our own set values and rules and game play. What a lot of people don't understand is that it is very difficult to keep EVERYONE happy. while there are things that everyone agrees on, there are many that they don't...no matter what happens things are gonna be done that make you happy and someone else pissed off. |
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Swordgleam Old Timer Posts: 510 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18351]
#18388 - 03/27/07 12:10 AM |
Quote: Quoted for truth. -------------------- Swordgleam - Level 40-something Arcane Fighter Vanishing into the wilderness from May 25 to late August. |
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Shaun Chicken Hawk Posts: 199 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18351]
#18392 - 03/27/07 01:32 AM |
Its like they always say, you cant please everyone all the time. But I also agree that communication could be better, it has always been a weakness of theirs, in my eyes anyway. |
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Trixi Rabbit Puncher Posts: 68 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18318]
#18394 - 03/27/07 02:48 AM |
Quote: Good point. I have no problems with the patch so I havent bothered with these threads. Im sure most of the people playing and enjoying the game don't even come to the forums. Also think the mods/devs responses on these boards are sufficient. I think people expect too much for little to no money..our time here is free; it aint so for the team. |
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Ragnar11 Armchair Warrior Posts: 42 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18394]
#18397 - 03/27/07 03:20 AM |
Quote:Quote: Exactly, its all about your wallet, isnt it? Companies in this world barely know what they are selling anymore.. Agree with that as long as people are happy with the game, thats the main thing ofcourse, but I am not talking about devs/mods making everyone happy, no no no. I am talking about them giving a good impression on how they threat their customers. I felt ignored at times, and last patch just confirmes that many new ideas was not even discussed with the player base. And we all have to agree that its the players (we) that have the most experience from playing, and I would also assume we had a role on the feedback aswell as the mods giving some feedback from their communication with the devs. |
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Laurana Old Timer Posts: 597 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18345]
#18400 - 03/27/07 04:19 AM |
Quote: but if she is a go between, then she should be going between both sides. players and devs. even if it was a quick "yup the devs said they like this idea, and would like to see it implemented asap" or "yup the devs said they like this, but it's not high priority for them atm" or "the devs do not feel this is right for DR" or "the devs hear you, and they agree/disagree. this will be fixed/not changed next patch" on most threads. even if it's a standard line. this was part of the reason i stopped playing. i think ive gotten feedback on 1 of maybe 15 bug reports on here.. and 1 of about 15-20 suggestion threads. its too low. also makes it easier to respond to people posting the same bug/suggestion to show a reponse from a mod/dev about it -------------------- The FAQ-Read it! Why isn't DR in beta? coz the Big Boss Man said so! Ivalaine - Lvl 50 Waynger |
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Shimmer New Kid Posts: 18 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18400]
#18405 - 03/27/07 07:25 AM |
Thank you Crickette... I personally appreciate that you let us know that our posts do get relayed to someone. First, normally I dont post over some minor change in a game (I am a long time MMO player). However, when they do something "big" and you see LOTs of posts of people who hate it, then I think the Devs should say something. This last patch is pretty much not loved by anyone that much (yes some do like it, but the majority of people like this game for the soloability and are not happy with the difficulty level being raised so severly). Second, I TOTALLY disagree (respectfully) with the opinion that this is 'their' game and we better just like it or quit playing. When a company puts out a product (and a game is a product) the consumer that is spending their money has every right to voice concern or discontent over the product if they dont feel that they are getting 'what they paid for'. Games even more so. A game company must realize that 1. people put in their time to play the game. Over the course of a game you might put in hundreds of YOUR hours playing the game. 2. people are paying money over a period of time. Yes its only $5 or $15 per month, but add that up over years. Those two facts mean that you have invested hours of time and possibly hundreds of dollars into a product, of course the company should listen to what their customers want/desire. SWG is a prime example of how NOT listening to your customers will bit you in your hiney (and guess what I STILL play it lol - glutton for punishment). They had a respectable player base that were dedicated to the game. They COMPLETELY disregarded what that player base wanted and the result is they lost a huge amount of their subscriber base. I think ultimately any game is probably in this biz to make money (like any business). If you disregard your customers wishes and comments (especially given that there are alot of other games (products) to play out there). You will lose them and thus your revenue. This last patch generated alot of not so happy customers and I started this post because I am one of those people that is concerned that this last patch might ruin the game for me as well. There were alot of people who were also concerned and I couldnt see that in the face of all of these people showing alot of concern that no Dev was taking a few moments to reassure us that the concerns would be addressed. hehe and I am sorry if I rambled to much on this one... I havnt got enough sleep (sick baby) and have guzzled about two pots of coffee. So I will stop now LOL .-------------------- *~*~*shimmer*~*~* the robeless mage
!!!vote for robes now!!! Edited by Shimmer (03/27/07 07:28 AM) |
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Ragnar11 Armchair Warrior Posts: 42 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18405]
#18409 - 03/27/07 08:29 AM |
As Laurana and Shimmer both said, some feedback to us from whats happening in between you Moderators and the Devs would give us atleast a chance to know what we should expect. I guess if NCsoft is serious about their buisness they would have made some kind of shudule on how long till next patch, even tho it could change. Atleast give us somthing. Its like giving money to charity orginasations. If you dont know whats happening within, your and everyone elses money may aswell end up at the Boss account, and not where the money was suppost to go. To know what is happening, and if our time is worth somthing, (writing constructive posts, playing the game, beta testing etc) we have to know what is happening on the inside. We cant read NCsoft employees minds, only look at what have been said and done previously. And after the last patch, yes, I did feel abit concerned on the communication. |
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LiquidX Actual Hawk Posts: 286 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18400]
#18439 - 03/27/07 11:31 AM |
Quote:Quote: While this would be nice, I'm not sure how much feedback the Community Coordinator actually gets *back* from the Dev's. I do know, however, that they send reports *to* the Dev's, containing our feedback. Of course, we're lucky the Dev's actually talk to us on the forums. Some Dev's for other games won't, and some only use "messenger" type people to post on the forums for them. (Note: Although this isn't to say that NCSofts communication is perfect, and couldn't use some improvement.) |
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Hiklo New Kid Posts: 9 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18439]
#18453 - 03/27/07 12:25 PM |
Ya its weird Stephen should have at least update his announcement post since he said he would have more info Monday. |
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BeRockedOn New Kid Posts: 1 |
Re: Where are some Devs?? [Re: #18453]
#18576 - 03/28/07 04:20 AM |
I think that it's a choice they made long before we even got here. They spend x hours a day coding to reach their next "goal/patch" wich content/changes allready have been decided. Then when done, they look at the suggestions from the forum and go trough and find the stuff they think will be best (or fast and effective) to include in their next patch and then they stat all that process all over again. We don't even know if she get feedback from the devs, she might, she might not. Also maybe they like having suprise parties?  I'm a dev myself (no not for game applications coded in c++ or python or whatever). I do (small) website applications. Last year i made a small game with a friend and included a forum on the site. Then people started coming with suggestions and so on, but the problem was i allready had a list of things to add for the next 6 months! I pretty much understand "both sides" point of view, but in the end there's ONE person who decide how this community AND game is taken care of, and thats the top dog of this project/game. I'm just glad that i not only have the option to play this game for free, but have a good and fun time doing so. We play this game to have fun! If you disagree..... well uhm... i don't see why you would so whatever. The point is, as long we support this game, the better it will get, some MMOs spend years before they got their game "just right" and some goes for the communication on the forums. Hope somebody liked my point of view See ya all In-game! Have an awesome day. |
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