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DenizH Armchair Warrior Posts: 29 |
A few PvP suggestions..
#51921 - 03/22/08 12:43 PM |
Right I am going to get out anything that irritates me in PvP.. 1. I think first of all, I really get irritated being matched up with high levels(80-100). My alternative account, its name is RangedRevenge. I have spent alot of time trying to gte the correct gear for my level 23 ranger to be succesfull. The level 100's have not got good "PvP gear" yet they still overbalance me with their buffs. For example my fear shot would last for approximately 3 seconds and level 100 rangers can cast them for about 10 seconds. I would strongly reccomend upgrading all skills alongside the great level 101 rebalance. 2. I hate runners, enough said, please can develeopers think of a logical way of preventing people from running continuesly. Perhaps a new offensive skill.. I am sure you can think of something ![]() 3. Finally get rid of spirit of the hare and light in the loafers. This realtes to my second idea. It is a "runners skill", someone who is incapable of fighting fairly. I am very sure the majority of you will disagree with this remark. But listen to me. Spirit of the hare: Increases movement speed by XX% for XX seconds. Why is this neccesary for pvpers? To run and annoy the opponent so the stronger plyer wont win, sort it out guys. Light In The Loafers: Prevents any offensive skills that slows your movement speed. People spend alot of money on skills such as ice bolt, holy roler etc. Why? Because its a good tactic against runners and slows their attack and movement speed, whats the point of doing that if as soon as you do it the opponent uses Light In The Loafers. 4. Make offical guild, i am aware this topic has been raised on numerous occasions but I am not sure what the situation is, if its a yes no or maybe ![]() I just want fairer PvP's, i really don't care if people cant win any other way, pepole who are not good at pvp go on a bloody pve world, simple as. All coments are welcome. Thanks for your time -------------------- ´*•.¸(*•.¸;¸;¸.•*´)¸.•*´ _ «::•° .-DenizH- .°•::» _ "REFUSE TO LOSE" .¸.•*(¸.•*´;¸;`*•.¸)`*•¸. Edited by DenizH (03/22/08 12:49 PM) |
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mess_ion_ic Actual Hawk Posts: 275 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions..
#51953 - 03/22/08 05:26 PM |
I understand your irritation; I felt the need to vent recently after some frustrating experiences in pvp. Like it or not, running is a valid tactic. Mages, especially, don't have the def or HP (excluding the effects of BSoL) to stand with a fighter or ranger. Also, since there are speed de-buffs, there must be a counter, which "Loafers" provides. However, it can only be used once every 30 seconds or so, depending on the skill's lvl, and it only lasts for 15 seconds. I know it can be quite irritating to chase and chase and chase someone, but I would suggest adjusting your tactics to compensate. As far as your last comment, how can you expect someone to get good at pvp without experience? Pvp isn't an innate ability, you know. |
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Ripper_McGee Karl's "bad cavern" spelunker Posts: 2,248 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #51953]
#51962 - 03/22/08 05:42 PM |
Quote: There's a difference between kiting and running. Kiters stop and attack periodically, runners just freakin' run. A classic example is for a player to get a single kill or at least a tie, then literally run and hide for the rest of the match. Very irritating. Obviously, this is a player who cares more about win counts than the challenge of combat. There are also players who recognize that they're outmatched, but refuse to admit it. They'll just keep running from you, never really trying to attack. They'd rather tie with zero kills than forfeit or lose... |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 1,061 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions..
#51988 - 03/23/08 01:37 AM |
Quote: |
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mess_ion_ic Actual Hawk Posts: 275 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #51962]
#51991 - 03/23/08 02:03 AM |
Quote: Fair enough, but it's a fine line (depending on who you ask). Technically, getting the first win puts the burden on your opponent. The specifics of pvp etiquette (before/during/and after match) is fuzzy at best... |
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Anonymous Actual Hawk Posts: 340 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions..
#52061 - 03/23/08 07:17 PM |
1.I agree, skills should all be equal. 2.One resolution is teleporters that can get you to the other side of the arena in a sec. 3.I think they should keep it. I only run for kiting or healing hp. 4.I think they're working on it, it's unofficial coming from me. -------------------- Anonymous wrote the above. |
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FungusAmongUs Chicken Hawk Posts: 135 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52061]
#52096 - 03/23/08 11:21 PM |
Only one issue I dont like about this PvP system atm is having to cast a spell while standing still. Now for spells that take a duration to cast, standing still makes sense but instant casts should be able to be used on the run. This may seem very minor but really take a minute to reflect on its impact. It makes the combat a lot slower paced. One example is when chasing a runner, I have to stop to cast ice bolt which if I miss has just put me farther behind. Its an instant spell yet I cant use while running. Id love to use strafing technique while shooting spells/attacking. -------------------- Altstar: 15 RB Hunter Ranger 97% :: Fighter 97% :: Mage 98% My Gear & Wishlist :: L10 RBs for trade! |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 1,061 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52096]
#52101 - 03/24/08 01:44 AM |
Oh yes, it will be very useful when you're chasing someone. But what if you are a Fighter and a Mage is Kiting you? They can run while attacking, this could possibly mean you'll never catch them. |
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Cthulhu Chicken Hawk Posts: 168 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52096]
#52106 - 03/24/08 02:36 AM |
Quote:I'm a bit confused.... *If* I am understanding you correctly you are wanting to add elements of First Person Shooters to PvP yes? IMHO, if implemented at all, Running and Strafing would be better suited for Rangers who already use (for lack of a better term) Crossbows, rifles, shotguns, grease guns, machine guns and pulse rifles don't you think? Mages at the higher levels are already pretty powerful so all you have to do if a fighter is running toward you is let off a few well placed shots then blow by him with spirit of the hare or light in the loafers, get some distance and do it again. Lather, rinse, repeat until dead. Unless I am missing something here, I really don't see the need for Mage's to have something better suited for Rangers. -------------------- "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn" - Cthulhu fhtagn: 47°9′S, 126°43′W Cthulhu's Character Stats |
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Legendrunner Fully Decked out Skittle Posts: 1,343 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52096]
#52136 - 03/24/08 07:23 AM |
Quote: Could be implanted still, with extra skills for a fighter to reflect. I mean.. a mage can oput EVERYTHING in INT already now because of BSOL, mind that we cant and have to get maybe 6 to 8 times the amount of health. This already is a weakness, so if they implant things like bsol for fighter, or a 10 sec 70% block magic cover shield for ranger, it'll be equal again. And mind.. that that can be very cool for pvp too. |
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Synne Rabbit Puncher Posts: 90 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52136]
#52171 - 03/24/08 01:35 PM |
I'm not sure boyo, that seems like a lot of useless skills for PvP only...what's the use of an Anti-magic protective shell for the other two classes, when people are already battling them successfully by dodging bolts, and using the "stand-in-mage" technique when they start spamming Shadow Bolts? Edited by LoricaSegmenta (03/24/08 01:36 PM) |
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Anonymous Actual Hawk Posts: 340 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52106]
#52172 - 03/24/08 01:35 PM |
Quote:Quote:I'm a bit confused.... If DR was a first person shooter, you would have to get a radical on the enemy. The people with lag will usally die. There is a 1st person RPG for 360, it's called Mass Effect (sorry devs, don't know any of the other NcSofts games to compare it to). Also if this was a first person shooter, fighters would have weps similar to Halo's energy swords and gravity hammers (or weps that do tons of close range dmg). -------------------- Anonymous wrote the above. |
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FungusAmongUs Chicken Hawk Posts: 135 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52172]
#52216 - 03/24/08 11:02 PM |
A lot of MMORPG have instant cast spells/skills = able to use while moving. I wouldnt call it FPS element, its a pretty standard feature for many MMORPGs. -------------------- Altstar: 15 RB Hunter Ranger 97% :: Fighter 97% :: Mage 98% My Gear & Wishlist :: L10 RBs for trade! |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 1,061 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52216]
#52220 - 03/25/08 12:36 AM |
But what of kiting? Mage runs while shooting bolts behind him/her. Allowing skills to be cast while moving will certainly make chasing easier, but it may also make kiting easier too. |
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FungusAmongUs Chicken Hawk Posts: 135 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52220]
#52230 - 03/25/08 02:37 AM |
Uh, I didnt realize it was so easy to run backwards in this game, please tell me how. Or how to fire bolts out my [censored]. -------------------- Altstar: 15 RB Hunter Ranger 97% :: Fighter 97% :: Mage 98% My Gear & Wishlist :: L10 RBs for trade! |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 1,061 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52230]
#52232 - 03/25/08 02:55 AM |
Step 1: Turn your camera so your character is facing you. You may use the left and right arrow keys to swivel your camera. Step 2: Activate the "Spirit of the Hare" skill. This step is optional. Step 3: Press the "Back" button on your keyboard to make your character run towards the screen. You are now looking behind your character as he/she runs. Use the minimap to navigate. Step 4: Fire at the enemy who is chasing you from behind. You have a choice of Fire Bolt, Ice Bolt, Shadow Bolt or Ice Shards. You are now operating the tactic known as "Kiting". |
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FungusAmongUs Chicken Hawk Posts: 135 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52232]
#52235 - 03/25/08 05:10 AM |
That is you running forward looking behind you, NOT running backwards. 1) How would you be able to see where you are heading, to avoid obstacles, if you cant see what's in front of you? 2) How are you able to shoot bolts behind you since you are still facing away from your target. -------------------- Altstar: 15 RB Hunter Ranger 97% :: Fighter 97% :: Mage 98% My Gear & Wishlist :: L10 RBs for trade! |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 1,061 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52235]
#52236 - 03/25/08 05:15 AM |
1) Minimap? As stated? 2) So therefore, running and shooting ONLY works when your character is perfectly, exactly aligned with the target? That is completely and utterly pointless then, because there is almost no way you can align your character perfectly with your target. I have assumed that with running and attacking, animations for "twisting" movements will be implemented. Even if you are aiming just slightly away from the direction of your character, you will require a new animation or it will look awkward. Obviously, turning beyond about 45 degrees is more complicated than just turning at the waist, but I assumed that, if a gameplay mechanic like "attack while running" is implemented, then it will not be restricted to forward attacks. If you expected it to work differently, perhaps you should have stated that it will only work for forward attacks. |
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FungusAmongUs Chicken Hawk Posts: 135 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52236]
#52237 - 03/25/08 05:28 AM |
Minimap doesnt help see other enemies if your against more than 1 player. I dont even know what you are talking about, perfect alignment?. I want same mechanics as they are now just to shoot a freaking bolt forward while running. Having to stop to cast slows down the pace of pvp. So you mean to tell me that by me saying I want to be able to use an instant spell on the run (which currently non-aoe spells only shoot forward from the player) you took that as I want all the other complicated stuff you just stated. INSTEAD just interprating it as me wanting to keep the current shoot forward mechanic but just being able to do it while running?? Im sorry I didnt specify before. -------------------- Altstar: 15 RB Hunter Ranger 97% :: Fighter 97% :: Mage 98% My Gear & Wishlist :: L10 RBs for trade! |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 1,061 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52237]
#52243 - 03/25/08 08:42 AM |
Quote: Ok, let me explain myself more clearly. The current mechanic for shooting is that you click on a specific point and your character will fire in that direction. We all know that. You proposed the idea of being able to shoot and run at the same time. Currently, when you attempt to shoot while running, your character stops and immediately faces the direction of you shooting. If your idea is implemented, then that means the direction your character shoots at: and therefore, the direction he/she faces and turns to will be different to the direction his/her legs are carrying him/her. Obviously, this will require new animation, because I do not think there currently are animations that allows your character to "twist at the waist". Now, my question: the idea will make kiting, ie. shooting backwards while running, easier. Your counter: how is it possible to shoot bolts out of one's hindquarters? My answer: you don't, you turn backwards to shoot, which obviously requires more animating. By your counter to my question, I believe you don't think the idea will require more animating: since you are basing your counter on that there will be no new animations to accommodate "shooting behind". You also mentioned there is no "running backwards" animation, and I think you believed it will not be implemented to accommodate this idea of yours. However, if any running while shooting behaviour that requires more animation is disallowed, then the only possible way to shoot while run is directly forwards, because to shoot at any angle other that the direction your character is running will require new animation involving turning at the waist. The problem with this is that DR's combat system is not an FPS. You don't press a key and you automatically shoot directly forwards: you need to aim your attacks with your mouse, and your direction of movement is independent of your mouse. Basically, in FPSes, movement and aiming is tied together: in DR, they are separate elements. Since there is no "press this key and you automatically shoot in the direction you are running at" thing in DR, and you can only aim with your mouse, this means that you generally will not be able to click on a position that is "directly forwards" of you. Now, if you disallow all "running while shooting" angles that requires new animation, that will mean that it will be very hard to actually do it, and therefore make it pointless. So far, I have assumed that what you meant is any angle of fire that requires new animation is disallowed, because you assumed that my question of shooting backwards is not possible without a "running backwards" animation, and since you made the counter you believed that this animation or any other (such as shoot behind you) will not be included to allow shooting backwards while running. I hope you understand my meaning. |
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FungusAmongUs Chicken Hawk Posts: 135 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52243]
#52410 - 03/26/08 11:52 PM |
Unfortunately I dont have much time to post but shift+click allows you to shoot in direction you point without targetting someone. But yeah I see where the issue is b/c this game allows click to move. Id love to have a bolt shoot without me having to hold shift or allow me to run and shift+click to fire a bolt off. -------------------- Altstar: 15 RB Hunter Ranger 97% :: Fighter 97% :: Mage 98% My Gear & Wishlist :: L10 RBs for trade! |
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Necrophilius Veteran Posts: 1,061 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52410]
#52434 - 03/27/08 07:54 AM |
In truth, I like your idea of firing spells while running, because it is quite frustrating to shoot an Ice Bolt, miss, and your opponent slips through your fingers due to those precious seconds you spent standing still to cast the spell. I just thought it could work both ways. Obviously, it could simply be done so that say, you cannot shoot and run at angles more than 60 degrees from the direction your character is facing, and that will make it useless for Kiting, but make chasing down people more plausible. |
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MagicNinja Rabbit Puncher Posts: 86 |
Re: A few PvP suggestions.. [Re: #52410]
#54124 - 04/11/08 03:55 AM |
It all sounds well and good if you are a mage or a ranger, but how would you feel as a fighter, trying to run away (for whatever reason, be it to be cheap and tie or stalemate(which is a despicable tactic and all who do it should be pommeled, figuratively and literal. Or for a valid reason, ie. to regen, or cool down skills). Mages are almost twice as fast as a fighter anyway, and rangers, depending on gear, aren't far behind, so its not that difficult to catch up anyway, as long as you do it right. And being able to fire while running, would be a BIG advantage. Fighters wouldn't stand a chance. And high level, mostly 100s, mages have the advantage anyway, between full intel with bsol and sheer speed, they're hard enough to beat. Running while shooting in this pvp format would be completely broken. But for pve would be outstanding. As an fyi, high lvl mages dont even need full rb gear to be this powerful, in fact, most i see, use mostly yellows with a smattering of purples, because despite what you may believe, its about as hard to get full purple gear with all the same elemental bonus as it is to get full rbs. And until recently the only full elemental special gear was the death set, which was fire, along with staff of rarrr or dual clickers(but lacking in elemental rings). Now you can get full shadow mage rbs, head to toe. For some reason the devs over looked an RB weapon with ice bonus, hmm, i hope we get at least one in the next heave. Even with the new ones i'm stuck with Hydrostatic or fire/ice( is there a specific build name??) Yay, more of my ramblings, but food for thought. |
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